Might as well hand them golden tickets because the new barges are exactly the kind of ships AFK miners and botters will appreciate. My question is...

Why are you promoting AFK mining and botting CCP?

On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).

Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence.

A pr0 tanked hulk RIGHT NOW can reach 30-40k EHP even without dumb faction mods. After the buff, it's easily double that. The other ships are going to be even better. I am fitting a battle skiff as we speak.

You fail to see motivations. Destroying mindless bots is fun and profitable now. Post-gank, it will be too much of a hassle.

Reporting them would be :effort: and actually counter to our best interests--indeed, letting them run is quite good for us! Bots reduce the price of minerals and ships. They hurt miners, but not PVPers; so it's actually all up to you to report them. We'll just shake our heads and move on to find some nice fool hauling his life around in a badger.

I am laughing and posting because carebears don't seem to realize how their wishes for safer mining and larger ore holds can backfire hilariously, as if enacted by a genie with a twisted sense of humor.

Sure, you can mine safely and AFK... for 5 mil isk/h.

The difference being that freighters and orcas haul billions, and the only other hisec ships to warrant the effort are blinged out incursion/mission runners, also worth billions.


As for the proof of the bot population: That's easily answered. Ice Interdiction: in the beginning, there were 30+ macks in an ice belt, mindlessly working away. After a few days of concentrated ganks, the bot population went away--they migrated to other regions where their ISK generation wouldn't be encumbered. The remaining population was the humans too dumb to realize this basic economic reality. It went from exhumers so thick you couldn't swing a cat around without hitting one, to ghost belts.

Our opposition to this is twofold: One, ganking is fun. Won't deny it. This nerf all but removes it. Sad, but oh well.
Two, and more importantly: this creates a virtual risk-free activity in eve. Low/Nul barges can still be killed, but hisec gets concord, so EHP past a certain level means guaranteed surivival. Low risk/reward? Try no risk for reward.

And yes, our efforts DID result in hisec mining being worthwhile for the first time in...a looong time. Smart miners who fit something called "tanks" to their exhumers and were semi-active at the game could easily shrug off attacks and avoid them. And make isk hand over fist. Good luck with that once this nerf hits; trit's gonna fall like a rock within a few weeks.

continue to believe that hulkageddon was totally irrelevant and had no effect on hisec mining despite the 15k kills, most of which were in may

continue to believe that hisec mining will remain as profitable as it is now even with substantially reduced ganking and lower-tier barges/exhumers having substantially higher yield and tank than they do now

drone alloys were a significant source of high-ends, not low-ends

and then decided that they should never be ganked ever because, as they have shown through their actions (repeated concord buffs, removal of insurance from concord kills, mining barge HP buff) hisec miners are a protected class

I would just like to hear what CCP intends to do with the increased botting and AFK mining these new barges will no doubt create. Also, don't tell me it won't happen because the new EHP for some of barges is increasing to the amounts of cruiser and one will be as good as any BS. Park them in high-sec ice field and walk away for an hour or have your isboxer and G15 keyboard or third party app set for botting - no fear of gank because sitting in a .7 ice field pretty much garuantees 100% safety.

a 500k isk rifter can paralyze a 3b isk vindicator

ah but that's not so true in a skiff with it's +2 warp stab bonus (which i think is still there on sisi... infact i should go and check that)

edit: oh no, the bonus has gone :( sad times.

"it should cost 1bn to kill a hisec miner" - lin-young borovskova, 2012

"cold, harsh universe" ahahahahahaha not really, welcome to MLP Online

the gradual removal of all nonconsensual pvp from hisec is a great idea, yes

i'm sure they'll enjoy the 3-month subscriber spike followed by everyone leaving for another MMO after they shed all of their core players

This is exactly why ganking and wardeccing should be made easier.

those are not core players

the core players are the ones who enjoy the pvp-centric aspect of this game, UGC and an economy that is almost entirely player-driven, the ones who hope that it stays this way

those are the players who have kept this game going since 2003, not the carebears who burn out after training for a hulk/tengu/CNR and realizing that saving the damsel in distress for the 20th time isn't that exciting

An RPG-7 can destroy a Digger in under a second. It costs a lot less than the digger, and it's used up in the process. Just like a catalyst.

Mining in .9 with a Skiff will have 0 risk. How much reward should you get?

Well you will need 10+ tornados to destroy one. Unlike a freighter (the other ship that requires this kind of coordination to kill), it can't contain 10 billion isk of loot. Hence, no one is going to pay a billion isk in tornados to kill a 100m isk ship.

Suicide Ganking is exactly as profitable as the victims make it.

Pretty sure ratting bots make more money than mining bots

Wow this whole thread gave me lots of chuckles. Gankers shedding tears over things not being so easy for them. Instead of adapting, they are crying. Where have I heard about that before?

Buff to Hulk isn't too much greater, a slight buff to armor and shields mostly, hull is actually weaker. Skiff and Mack's have those buffs but larger sig radius to go with it, making them more vulnerable to bigger guns. If you have to gank them, don't just fit for maximum damage(sounds alot like telling miners not to fit for maximum yield, doesn't it?), but fit for making your weapons more effective - target painters, webbers, scramblers.

Basically all CCP has done is given miners a 'security blanket' with camo paint on it to look like a nicely armored ship. Most miners will continue to mine as they have before, leaving them vulnerable to ganking. It will just take gankers with some smarts to pull it off.

I also had to laugh at the mention of the 'great coordination' to gank during the burn Jita event. A bunch of ships sat there outside the dock and ganged up on a ship. Big whoop on that. I've seen 12 yr olds pull of the same coordination when having water balloon fights too.

Lastly, the real reason gankers are so upset by the changes? You are going to see a lot less Hulks now as other barges and exhumers become viable alternatives. Coveterageddon or Procurerageddon or Retrieverageddon just does NOT have the same ring to it as Hulkageddon. So there you go. The real reason behind the tears explained.

I've seen lots of comments in the forums about it being a cold hard universe. Now it is harder for gankers. They've had it too easy for too long. I even saw many comments made on the Hulkageddon site by gankers saying their real goal was to make CCP change insurance payouts. "Don't blame us, blame CCP. Petition them to change it. It'll be better for everyone" So now we have these changes, lets adapt people.

We will adapt, that is why we are the stronger species. Lets not forget that suicide ganking has been nerfed in to the ground repeatedly. We're still here.

No....I love EVE. What I do not like is poorly thought out game mechanics.